page document the course of discussions that lead to the founding of Leistavia.
Below are edited portions from conversations taking place via email and on the
internet. The most recent is at the top.
interconnections between Estonian, Pitcairn and Norfolk culture that have been
located are: borders have been open to cultural influence and diversity; trees
and green energy; a particular sense of architecture, old walls; mediation by
who burned the British ship Bounty in Pitcairn Island in 1790 stopped being British
subjects when they did it, the Pitcairn Court of Appeal has been told.
the court hearing, held in the High Court at Auckland [New Zealand] yesterday,
Adrian Cook, QC, told three appeal court judges that Pitcairn had never been under
Zealand Herald July 27 2004 page A12
the mid-1980s [in Estonia] .... dangers united the people, and massive protests
occurred. On August 23, 1987, dissidents in Tallinn organized the first political
demonstration. The economic autonomy plans of the legal opposition were fully
supported. Social and economic ideas developed rapidly, and the society became
organized. At the joint conference of the creative unions on April 1--2, 1988,
a programme of action was presented: extending Estonia's economic and political
rights, halting the immigration flow, rehabilitating the victims of Stalinism,
cultural independence. The Popular Front was founded on April 13, and united masses.
The national flag was restored. The unprecedented political activity during the
summer of 1988 shook the post-Stalinist society thoroughly, the historical memory
of society was restored.
a result of public pressure, the Supreme Council passed a sovereignty declaration
on November 16, 1988, which acknowledged the supremacy of Estonian laws.... On
August 23, 1989, the popular fronts from the Baltic States organized a 600 km
long human chain from Vilnius to Tallinn, demanding freedom for the Baltic States.
January 1991, Moscow interfered directly with the internal affairs of Estonia,
but this did not lead to the fall of the legal government. On the referendum of
March 3, 1991, 77.8% of the population (including 1/3 of the immigrants living
here) supported restoring the independence of Estonia.
August 24, Russia acknowledged the independent Republic of Estonia. On August
27, the EEC States, on September 2, USA and on September 6, the Soviet Union,
recognized the independence of Estonia. On September 10, Estonia became a member
of the CSCE and on September 17, of the United Nations Organization.
basic thesis is that Pitcairn was the first 'Intentional Community' to be founded
such the mutiny [on HMS Bounty] was one of the first fundamental acts of
schism & heresy against the dominant thrust of European imperial expansion
which for the sake of historical convenience may be dated as beginning in 1492.
This expansion has been referred to by some historians as 'The Great Western Liberal
Pitcairn/Norfolk 'experiment' may be constructed as both a reproach to & critique
of, mainstream western civilization; *_particularly_* it's legal-rationalist-bourgeois
Estonian Constitution of 1992 [edited]
3 Rule of Law, International Law (1) ... Universally recognized principles
and norms of international law shall be an inseparable part of the Estonian legal
5 Natural Resources The natural wealth and resources of Estonia are national
assets, which shall be used sparingly.
17 Honor No one's honour or reputation may be defamed.
18 No Torture or Cruel Punishment (1) No one may be subjected to torture or
to cruel or degrading treatment or punishment. (2) No one may be subjected
to medical or scientific experiments without his or her freely given consent.
Right to Self-Realization (1) Everyone shall have the right to free self-realization.
37 Education (1) Everyone shall have the right to an education.
38 Freedom of Science and Teaching (1) Science and the arts, and their instruction,
shall be able to exist freely.
41 Freedom of Belief (1) Everyone shall have the right to hold his or her opinions
49 Ethnic Identity Everyone shall have the right to preserve his or her ethnic
issue as you have written below is exactly at the heart of the discourses worldwide,
where indigenous rights are concerned. It is difficult, the question reflects
these issues felt in several places.
Ian Clothier [email].
2 of the proposed Leistavian constitution form: Should all nationalities have
equal rights? Answer Yes if all are equal, or No if indigenous rights should be
and no. An issue on Norfolk is the rights of Norfolk descendants migrating to
the Island. On one hand, it's preferential treatment based on race and discriminatory.
On the other, what is the purpose of a homeland if descendants aren't allowed
to go home? My own feeling, using Norfolk as a model, is all residents/citizens
are equal regardless of nationality, but and similar to England and Ireland, lineage
gives precedence when it comes to entry and migration.
Rick Kleiner [email].
is a border state in the deepest sense of the word. It has accumulated transition
areas of many types of nature and culture, and therefore the concentration of
different borders in Estonia is higher than in most other places in the world.
We have borders such as granite base - sedimentary rocks; sea-continent; forest-field;
Indo-Germanic-Finno-Ugrian; Germanic-Slavonic; Scandinavia-Central Europe. Our
landscapes balance the border state. Concentration of borders, as we well know
from geography, is the best indication of diversity. Besides, according to Juri
Lotman, the border areas are semiotically the wealthiest.
style of woodcarving carried out on Pitcairn Island is believed to have been introduced
by a Bristol shipwright who landed in 1823 and lived for many years on the island.
Later, an Austrian wood carver spent some time on Pitcairn and probably modified
the technique and style... The woven and plaited ware, on the other hand, has
undoubtedly been handed down from the Polynesian side of the mixed ancestry, an
and it is very similar to the fine woven products of eastern groups of the South
McBean, Handicrafts of the South Seas. South Pacific Commission publication,
Value Proposition: acceptance of a 'social-contract' as the foundation of Norfolk's
future demographics policy
The Norfolk Island community must - as
with any organic entity - continue to grow & change; although we suspect that
the absolute upper limit on total population growth is around 3,000.
we believe that the bedrock foundation of Norfolk's future demographics policy,
should be a universal recognition by all concerned, that the Island was - contractually
- 'vested in perpetuity' to the Pitcairn Islanders & their Descendants in
1856; & their Rights as a First Nation must be enshrined in any future constitutional
To our mind, in practical terms, this should mean - in a
nutshell - that ALL legislation enacted on the Island (or directed at the Island,
from offshore) must also be ratified by at least two-thirds of a 'House of Review'
or 'Senate' composed exclusively of (elected) Islanders - 3 would suffice - of
Pitcairn Descent, before being passed into Law; & ultimate sovereignty over
the Island should remain with the British Crown.
The objective here is
not to discriminate in favour of Pitcairn Descendants; but to ensure that they
can live with peace of mind as a minority in their own Homeland, secure in the
knowledge that they will never be displaced or dispossessed.
and I agree with you in your statement regarding green-backed beetles, wasps,
rats, mice, our blighted coconuts, and our dry rot that is laying low so many
of our orange trees... I recall the days when this island was practically free
of noxious weeds and grasses over at Pulau, and one could walk anywhere there
and pick pandanus palm-nuts, coconuts, and a lost pocketknife could be easily
found... Look at any other spot on the island and what do we see - the land overrun
with a score or more of unwanted and troublesome plants. Not knowing their scientific
names we have called them Alwyn grass, foxtail, broomstick, cowgrass, lantana,
morning glory. These and many others are eating up our land.
R.P. (1962) Letters to the editor. Pitcairn Miscellany 4(4), p 2 cited by Pierre
of Pitcairn Yahoo Group [FoP] Digest Number 1681.
is quite inherent to Estonia in these days is the total mess of values of life
- what I mean is that the enormously rapid economic growth has deranged most of
our people. There are certain material values without which you are nothing -
like a new car (preferably late version of BMW) or a new apartment or a housebox
in a totally new living area, or just to have a lifestyle which goes along with
the material world and consumer society...and for money, one is allowed to do
anything for example cut forests and sell the wood to Russia etc. And of course
our latest most popular subject is the European Union which is our second home
now, but actually there has been quite a heavy discussion about it, is it good
or is it bad...the main reason to get into EU was the fear of big Russia beside
us, but many people see it as a new Soviet Union...so, who really knows... but
probably lot's of people won't survive the increase of living costs...
Kylli Mariste [email].
main cultural groups in Finland, Estonia, Norfolk Island and Pitcairn Island are:
Finn, Turk, Swede, Sami, Roma, Tatar, Estonian, Russian, Ukranian, Belarusian,
descendants of Bounty mutineers, English, Tahitian, Australian, New Zealander,
Maori, Polynesian and others.
Clothier [email] - thanks to Genco Gulan.
been doing some research about Estonian roots and it seems that lately there have
been some changes in the concept of Estonian nationality - instead of coming from
Ural mountains many thousands of years ago (that means that we have some Mongol
descent) the latest news is that Estonians are actually very European, coming
from the south - from the region of Ukraine and having DNA similarities with our
closest neighbours Latvians and Lithuanians. But the fact is that Estonia has
been from the 13th century almost always conquered by some other nationality,
mostly Germans and Russians, but also Danish and Swedish who have had quite big
influences over Estonian culture and nationality.
more traditional view of culture is that culture is fixed and what persists. Culture
gets described in terms of traditional costume, traditional songs and beliefs.
When culture is looked at from the hybrid perspective, change and transformation
become more apparent.
thing of interest to me is the impact that DNA information has on concepts of
culture. Do you know anything of the distant history of DNA in Estonia? For example,
the indigenous people of New Zealand are Maori. It turns out that in DNA terms,
traces to origins in Chinese DNA can be found. This goes backs many thousands
of years. So here is one very distinct culture that has roots in another very
distinct culture. It is very hard to see that they have any connection at all
today. However, the DNA record is a sign of cultural transition over many thousands